Quote from NightEye :

He just wanted to review a replay.


Earlier I said I had come across no bugs. But sometimes when I Shift+P, it selects a different skin setup than what I had on the car before pitting. It happened to me three times now.
Perhaps I must say most of my skins are 2560×2048, but it did jump to one of those aswell. But it might still be causing the problem.

I didn't have this before in Z13.

I noticed this too, especially on track changes on the servers with many racers online.

Thanks for pics, but who won?? Got any results?? :P :P

Really great vid. Jens!!! We can all see that FLP/r rules!!

Quote from Skeete :

How about a 1.6 litre Ginetta G27

500kg and about 140bhp. Long wheelbased ultra lightweight limited power racing. Something thats missing from LFS.

LX4?
140Bhp
499KG
:eclipseeh

Quote from scania :

that's what I want

Ouch! that' s very bad for the environment and a total waste of energy lol! First nuke power, preferably nuclear fusion, then powergrid with 10-20 times the current capacity and only then electric cars might be an good idea.

Quote from J03130 :

Scawen will you be having more real life cars in S3 (if there ever is one) because i see the scirroco as a start so why stop...i know that you have to get licenses but im just curious to if you will be planning some more.

There already many real life cars in LFS. The start of real life cars was the MRT, the we got raceabout, BF1 and soon the scirocco. The uf1 might also be considerd a real life car resembling the old mini's of the sixtys.

lx4 and lx6 can also be considered real life cars, because you can buy car-kits to build your own lx4, lx6 or lx8. I am still hoping someday we will see the lx8 really appear in official version of lfs. But i guess the tires issue's have to addressed first.

@kaynd

I agree, but i think the effect is way too strong. In your very nice screen shots(!) it is visible the force might be a bit on the high side I doubt if kv-oval is an good comparison, because banking there is much higher and still.. you could not reproduce the same effect?

Also note, on FE the lifting from the right rear wheel is caused by the extreme grip of the left rear tyre, on kv oval its the banking which is causing it.

Its also weird the suspension travel ran out, settings are for fe track.. Rather high ride height; springs and dampers are set rather stiff compared to the ride height.
It would take 2900Newtons of force on one wheel at minimum! Minimum, because the anti-roll bars wiill make the suspension stiffer when cornering or sliding just like this. Anti-roll should have added at least 1950Newtons of extra springs tension in this particular situation. Total of at least 4850N on top of normal loading because of the weight of the car. I did not take into account the extra resistance the dampers would have given to resist the "shock" because i have no idea how to calculate that.

Does such heavy loading also happen irl with such corners? i don't know hehe

Last edited by Bluebird B B, Tue 16 Jun 2009, 15:13.

Quote from bunder9999 :

you sure you didn't touch the dirt with the left rear tire? a quick sudden loss of traction would throw the car sideways like that.

Correct, but its about the very high g-load and total tyre deformation caused by ditch in the track. I never seen such a thing happen irl.

Peak g-load is actually 5.11 g lol

Last edited by Bluebird B B, Mon 15 Jun 2009, 18:49.

Sorry i uploaded the correct replay now

Hello all,
First i though an old bug had returned about suspension being much too weak but then i noticed in the replay there is a severe ditch on track causing to a peak sideways g-load of 5.10 and total deformation of the left rear tire which was at maximum pressure. I would expect such things only to happen with under inflated tires, but not with tires at maximum pressure.

I never seen such thing happen during any formula race, so i wonder whether it is realistic. If such a hole was in a real track they would fix it before allowing formula cars racing on it. formula cars in such slides happily bounce all over the place, track or gravel trap, and then continue to race if they didn't hit the wall or something like that.

In the replay its at 2:58:13 with my car(Bluebird) in the fast,but dangerous, full throttle right hander.

Is this realistic or a bug?

Last edited by Bluebird B B, Mon 15 Jun 2009, 14:39.

Quote from scania :

but the out put curve is different
Petrol car need to wait the maxium torque come, but diesel car can supply power very fast

I'm sorry that is not true.

Diesels are actually slower to get on power and torque because they usually need higher turbo-pressures to achieve the same performance. Also petrol engines do everything at slightly higher revs including idling. The T5 from volvo does not have noticable turbo lag or slow responses. There are petrol engines which do need a lot of revs to get the turbo-charger generate enough pressure, mitsubisi lancer evo's for example. BUT try find an equvilant 2 liter diesel.... There isn't any that even gets close to the performance of the evo's engines!

Also petrol engines with low-pressure turbo's feel like an electric engine, loads of torque as low as 1500rpm al the way up to 6000 rpm. Only way to match this with a diesel is by fitting a much better turbo-charger and injection systems.

Quote from RasmusL :

Well, you CAN adjust the amount of downforce

You are missing the point.

F1 cars up up to 2008 seaon have specialized body-kits and wings for extreme tracks. A BF1 with aero package for monza would really suck at monaco. Even suspension is specially adjusted for some tracks. I don't mean different settings but really different parts.

For ovals it is much more extreme, outside wheels are usually bigger then inner side, smaller wings, which are much more efficient in generating a little bit downforce. Also the tyres-compounds are not the same as on normal tracks giving better grip then regular tyres at high speed.

Big wings cause a lot more drag at high speeds even at minimal settings and you don't need much downforce on an oval track. All the small winglets and weird shapes on the bodywork of an F1 car are not designed for ovals and not optimal for 340+km/h. Also the diffuser will most likely be a different shape which would be really bad below 200km/h but great at speeds over 300km/h

F1 don't drive on ovals, but if they did they would use the same small wings as indy/cart series on the big 2mile ovals. So an 2006 F1 car with aero package for an big oval-track will reach 390-410km/h or even a lot more...and on south city it will really feel like a very different car so many parts will be replaced by parts designed for low-speed normal tracks.

edit: tried to correct the worst typos

Last edited by Bluebird B B, Sun 14 Jun 2009, 16:54.

Quote from Not Sure :

A "drift car" so that drifters would finally shut up about it, and it would be easier to filter those servers out.

I agree lol

Quote from scania :

diesels have torque

Petrol engines with equally big turbochargers have a lot more torque and twice the amount of hp output of the diesel.

I drive myself an diesel, it drives nice but the equivalent petrol engine with comparable turbo pressure is a serious amount faster see the fowllowing examples( Site is dutch though )
Diesel*:
http://www.autoweek.nl/carbase ... php?id=26212&cache=no
petrol*:
http://www.autoweek.nl/carbase ... php?id=30580&cache=no
*Both cars have usually a higher topspeed than stated in specifications
pk=hp
vermogen=power
koppel=torgue
tpm=rpm=revs per minute

However maximum radius on one tank of diesel is 1400-1500km though so i catch up at the gasstations

Hope this will really clarify for diesel enthusiasts that diesel engines do not have more power than comparable petrol engines and maximum torque is actually very similar. But the petrol engine has a much wider powerband and feels like it has more torgue.

Since this is the topic about cars we wanna see in lfs: Race version of volvo 240 or 740

I tried to be there, but something called IRL/family got in the way

I managed to get away and watch the start @
http://www.liveforspeed.se/tv
and it looked like You had really fun and tight racing out there

Until next time
Best wishes
SRS»Andy

Quote from JasonJ :

The BLANK OVERFLOW is because your PC has issues and crashes. I don't think this solution is what he needs.

Well, that's what I said in my post
And those issues might be caused by Windows issues, wich can be related to some unwanted processes, wich can be closed by ending explorer.exe's process tree.
You were 100% right in the post, but it's not necessary to put me to the wall.

Oh, and i think this was my last post over here, because people feel superior, and just like to flame.

Last edited by Gabriel B., Tue 9 Jun 2009, 13:23.

Time outs: poor network, wich i guess it's not your case.
The blank overflow message apears to me when my pc freezes. After it recovers from the drop, i lose connection to host and the blank overflow message appears.
Here's what I do: Every time turn on my PC, i open task manager, go to processes and search for Explorer.exe; Right click on it, End Process Tree; After that, go to Applications, hit "New Task" and type "explorer.exe". After I do this, my PC doesn't freeze so often (still does sometimes, it's crappy)
Should work better now :P

This was happening to me when i had the partition where i got LFS installed full.
Make sure the disk has some free space, like 1 Gb. to make it work fine.
That solved it in my case

We will be there:
SRS»Andy
SRS»Mike

I agree, espacially the formula one cars up to 2008 have lots of adjustments on aero. I think GTR's also have adjustments for tracks but indeed less than formula one cars.

I don't think lower formula cars similar fox and FO8 have these adjustments. The FOX is so underpowerd it has no use to have a special adjustments for city tracks just as for the FO8.
Only on ovals the package might be different, smaller front and rear wings which are more efficient at high speed but maximum possible downforce generated is a lot less than with regular wings.

What would be also very nice for the bf1, different tyres at each track. The tyres used on monza and monaca are very different, this was even more the case in 2006 with the tyre war that was at that time going on at that time. But their are already other topics about the tyre problems.

I certainly agree to different aero packages, but i think only the bf1 would be really affected. Special aero-package for oval would give topspeed of 20-30km/h higher then its current topspeed. Downforce might not be much more on city tracks, because F1 regulations forbid a bigger and/or higher rear wing.

Quote from Not Sure :

I see what you are saying, but...

Are you saying the pit crew has real time data of tire temps while the car is on the track?

I'm ok with the tire and damage data being visible only while pitting, "hardcore" mode or not.

Don't know, technically certainly possible with infared sensors fitted close to the tyres it should be no problem to get accurate readings.

I just have to agree with some posts before "we" as sim drivers also have to do the work of the engineers and chief of the team. As long as we don't have an fully automatic pitcrew and engineers who can setup the car perfectly adjusted to your driving style, We will need a bit unrealistic amount of information available. Especially because i want to drive and don't have the time to spent hours and hours to analyse collected data of several hours driving. Some people have a live beside lfs... And i'm already very short on time for getting the car to a perfect setup.

I guess that it has been done before, but this one is much simpler than the other.
Will test it and see if it works:P
Thanx!

Quote from jvcala2 :

yeah..i have seen drag cars specially the muscle ones flex their bodies....but idk what causes it to twist like that

2000+hp and as light as possible very long tube-frame. These cars just have to be drivable in straight line...

Quote from ajp71 :

.....
Conventional GT cars (of the type we have in LFS) use the rollcage as the structure of the car and the standard steel body (with most panels replaced with light weight composites as an option) simply there to comply with rules virtually unstressed and completely irrelevant to the performance of the car other than adding weight, ....

.....
GT cars with monocoque tubs in the road car (not the rare cars that have no resemblence to the production car and are purpose built racing cars with a caborn fibre tub)...,

Most average GT series do have a complete steel frame or monocoque instead of the original chassis and indeed have no resemblance to the original road car. Every time i watch some gt-series of any kind i notice it is a really different car. Just the shape of the outside shell remotely resembles the road car. Take the shell away and you got basicly a formula-class car. Even engines are totally replaced and sometimes moved to an new position in "budget" class gt series.
I think the gtr-cars of lfs are in such gt/gtr-racing class, with chassis/monocoque/tubeframes several times stronger then the orginal road car they were based on.

I am not opposed to the implementation of flexing of cars since it adds realism espacially to the slower road cars, but i doubt if it should be high on the priority list.

Last edited by Bluebird B B, Wed 3 Jun 2009, 14:43.

Quote from Simpson :

In terms of reliability i was taking about ball-bearing turbos. They're not the same what you have in stock car.
As i said earlier, diesel engines have turbos with VTG, and quite short rev band. So creating flat torque curve is quite simple. How often did you see flat torque curve in petrol car? Of course you can achieve that by changing boost at higher rpms, without doing same with lower rpms, but its not the point of reprogram the ECU.

The reason why factory is putting bigger turbo is to increase reliability, bigger turbo with lower boost = less material wear, colder air intake etc. In example, VAG 1.8T
150Hp = K03, 180Hp = K03s, 210Hp = K04, 225Hp = K04, on each turbo you can make additional +~30-40Hp, but that will be 100% of the efficiency turbo could give. Don't compare diesel cars to petrol cars in terms of turbocharging, Diesel turbo won't work that good in petrol and vice-versa.

You saying the same with the vag 1.8T, petrol or diesel both can nearly always be tuned 20-30% higher then stock as long as they are turbocharged. Even with software tuning regular road-cars don't have problems with loss of boost at high rpm' s. Petrol or diesel, doesn't really matter. Well i said ths, there will always be some manufactures who did fit a turbo-charger just large-enough for the engine....

The turbo's for diesel and petrol have very different loading in terms of temperature, the basic principle how they work are identical though. VTG turbo-chargers are available now too on very limited number petrol-engines, It works great on petrol too, but the higher temperatures makes it much more difficult to design a turbo with vrt for petrol. Porsche was the first manufacturer to do this successfully on a production car. Diesel turbo' s are bit different, because the exhaust gasses have different characteristics, especially the tempature is most different.